In 5 Rounds of Combat you are only dealing slightly more damage than a S&B Paladin. Also when we fight single strong enemy (most likely boss or semi-boss) and use Vow of Enmity we can make extra attack each time enemy under our Vow makes attack (doesn't need to hit) using our Soul of Vengeance feature. The thing is.. the Campaign will end at Level 10.. so maybe that build would be too long? However it's still an increase. This is one of manycharacters I hope to play at some point. Get Great Weapon Master for the -5/+10 to increase dps. This way we can keep group of melee enemies in constant "dance" while poking them with opportunity attacks. Str 15, Dex 8, Con 14, Int 8, Wis 12, Cha 14. You still lose one action to shove prone, and that is the big deal of grapple (but the enemy probably will succeed to leave the grapple in his turn). Pam raises the content strategy game by dropping in hot to learn about the client, but also the agency: how we approach the problem, how we work, and even how we talk. For what it's worth, as a DM I would rule the lance is a polearm anyway and allow it to be the trigger of the first bullet point, making this whole thing moot. When looking at build advice for Vengeance Paladins, there's always a lot of discussion around how well PAM/Sentinel works, but it always seems to hinge on rolling a Variant Human or Custom Lineagefor the extra feat. I'll say this one last time. But so what? - I have never said anything about Sentinel. Then turn by turn damage. It really is a simple feat. Back to Main Page 5e Homebrew Optimized Character Builds, https://www.dandwiki.com/w/index.php?title=Polearm_Sentinel_(5e_Optimized_Character_Build)&oldid=1704871. It matters not what spell I use to boost my single round damage with a 1 handed longsword when you cant do the same with a glaive. If this is your first visit, be sure to My only good homebrews:Races,Subclasses. Heavy Armor Master at level 1 is GREAT. It also gives you opportunity attacks on Disengage, so pesky casters can't get away from you without taking some much needed punishment. Paladins typically throw more dice than fighters, but they get less attacks. For that I will rely on my DM to provide that trainer when he feels the time is right. You are using an out of date browser. Theorycrafting will tell you that you should grab PAM first, as that will increase DPR more than anything else, and that you should grab STR or GWM second. Not gonna edit it now since you responded to it but ok. As mentioned earlier Disarm Attack & Pushing Attack can be a very effective combo. Not much against anything else. Important: The campaign will end around level 10. You shave off so much damage over your career its well worth it, and at low levels is a life saver. So this got me to think that Vengeance Paladin is a natural PAM class and you need PAM build to fully use Vengeance Paladin. The biggest thing people forget is their abilities that they have and can use on a regular basis. No I said average damage doesnt properly reflect the damage Paladins can deal. 201 Avg. Heres hoping you enjoy it and your party enjoys it too! 234 Avg. If we're talking about a true nova-burst character, I've run a paladin 2/divine sorc 9/bladelock 9 for DnD Beyond's Christmas one-shot. If you hit their movement goes down to zero. And where did I suggest doing damage in single turn vs. over period of time? 3 attacks or 6 with action surge. Spiking strength and constitution makes a reliable attacker, but dumping intelligence or wisdom to do so makes it hard for such a character to tell which enemy is actually the biggest threat. Yes some people have made maps but I'm telling you right now they had no idea this build could be made. 1. To the OP--the one thing I dislike about PAM is it locking you into a specific (couple of) weapon choices. Is Minotaur or Eladrin one of them too? If you're stopping around level 10, then it's really hard to beat a Variant Human (going from 2 to 3 ASIs is huge). As you can see the biggest difference between the two is 31 points for Max Crits but narrows down to 6 points at minimum damage. Fighter can probably do it better, due to having extra ASIs for it. With PAM, Sentinel, GWM its irrelevant as a Paladin. This gives you: Max Crit. I am pretty positive that RAI, they want you to use the polearm to make the opportunity attack. The benefit to this is an increased Wisdom save that would be at least a +10 save later on which highly beneficial being a Paladin. 2020 City Beach House, photographer Rob Frith If that's the case, you have to ask yourself if fun is your most important factor going in a game, and if that's the case, you definitely want to grab PAM+ Sentinel by lvl 8 if only because that's what'll bring you satisfaction and not being "on curve" or whatever. or Hammering horns? So what do you guys think is the best setup for Fighting Style, Weapon and Feats for my character? Optimize around average damage. Are my DEX/WIS/INT too low, or will Aura of Protection mitigate that. The power curve is you. 2. However, it's reaction melee attack on an ally being attacked isn't an AoO caused by movement and cannot be comboed with WC. GWM is a feat I find a bit boring with its pluses and minuses, while Sentinel+PAM gives you more options and cool stuff to do. Anyway, with a hexblade dip you can do it, but is it worth it? You can increase the effectiveness of a caster capable of casting a lasting area affect spell by using Pushing Attack or your Sentinel reaction keeping them in the area of effect. That was my take aways specifically because the quote you quoted me was in regards to avoiding being hit to deal the damage. 2023 Wizards. So I need to figure out what I should take on levels 1,4 and 8. You don't use a shield so this acts as some defense. Choose to smite on a critical in order to nova-burst since you now have almost 10% chance to crit. Your party will appreciate your bonus +4 to all saves after level 6. If you find gauntlets of ogre power or a belt of giant's strength, we can also throw in sentinel to negate disengages. so while you'd sacrifice [] the potential to take GWM. No multiclassing and assuming this is a level 1-20 campaign (blue sky thinking, I know). The defacto most powerful single class in the game. and RAI, you need to attack with the polearm in polearm master AoO. Unless it's an ambush or fighting game, you more often than not absolutely have at least 6 seconds to prepare yourself. By the way, I was never trying to imply this was in anyway optimal. Go with Str 15, Dex 12, Con 15, Int 8, Wis 9, Cha 12. The only thing I said is that I value Holy Weapon more than Banishing Smite because it has better utility (3 hits and you have closed the damage difference and you still have one hour left of buff). Such is the nature of a min-max. Stopping creatures in their tracks as a reaction isn't a common ability in the game. You'll be behind the curve, but in reality it's not by much because PAM+sentinel isn't too different from PAM+STR, you know? Which it is prone to do. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Scan this QR code to download the app now. At this point Holy weapons Max. You already have one of the best possible polearms, so unless your DM is a 'giveth and taketh away'-type, it seems like a good choice. This being said though you're a Paladin. As a Vengeance Paladin though you are less reliant on Charisma compared to a Devotion. crit vs. max crit and normal hit vs. normal hit max dmg is because of the sheer number of dice thrown. Now, would castinghold person orhold monster be better than castinghaste? JavaScript is disabled. The point of this combination of unusual weapons is to profit from the high hit die of a Lance, but never be stuck with Lance's disadvantage at 5ft range. You may be playing D&D for additional 15 years and you may never see it happen. I don't know where I suggested it. He will have a Soldier background. I'd use Tasha's optional rules to reassign my origin ASI's to +2 STR and +1 CHA. *One important detail is that the DM will ignore Sage Advice, he will only use the basic books like PHB. My mental image is that of a powerful warrior paladin, standing on the corpses of his enemies, everyone just scared shitless of them. It's an unquantifiable bonus, unlike the straight up DPS boost of GWM, but it's still a game-changer. Is it a home campaign with friends? Only about Polearm Master. This being said though it makes build encounters more challenging. run for it to have an effect. He will have a Soldier background. Because who cares how much damage you're dealing when nothing can hit you. As the title says, i want to build a paladin with PAM and Sentinel. This is a pure fighter build. Now I'm a Paladin main so I'm a poor example of this but it is exactly what Talisan Jaffey did when they started their campaign before he made Percy. Restrictions: First this is going to be all about melee Combat no ranged attacks. 5. Notably, Monster AC doesn't go high enough to compensate for all of those +x's that you're giving your PCs. 20 strength. Second discussing minimum and maximum damage isnt about dealing it. Fighter 2 - You get an action surge. For your fighting style, pick Great Weapon Fighting. Unless your say a champion fighter critting on 18s, 19, and 20s. Like what other races have synergy for that exact type of build, along with the Dueling fighting style using a Spear (Spear if want shield or just go Glaive)? If you have "Hot Dice" then go for it! Theres just flat numbers. Vengeance Paladins- a must PAM class to use full potential? Grow up. damage doesn't properly reflect damage dealt you are simply losing me. After this I would take the feats in this order: Normally I would take res con at lvl 4 just because of how clutch it ends up being but I see the benefits on not delaying what you want your character to do. I know, but you need polearm master + sentinel + mounted combatant + str + dex 14 + wis (if you want to cast something beyond hunter's querry), to that start to work, how you're not human v. we are talking about lvl 12. 2021 North Perth House, photographer Rob Frith. :). reach and attack of opportunity. 128 Min. Correct. Its also the reason why when playing with a bunch of new players an experienced Player plays a Paladin to keep the Party alive. This is just the opposite of my play style. Add 2 to your Str, for 18 Strength and a Maneuver DC of 15. :). However built right GWM can be used all the time. Now you get to re-roll those pesky 1's and 2's. My stance has and remains that your sacrificing more survivability to deal damage a single round faster as the difference between the two is negligible given smites. This gives you +10 to damage with a cost of -5 on the attack roll, a 25% additional miss chance. It's great especially for vengeance paladins who get to move when taking opportunity attacks. At lvl 18 this extends to 168 tiles around you. So PAM gives us with level 5 = 3 attacks + opportunity attacks each time enemy comes to our range (which is 10 feet with polearm). The less dice you throw the more chance you have for max damage. With Haste on and PAM that boosts our attacks per round to 5. polearm vs great weapon vs longsword. Click the link to learn more. Min-maxing damage output is fun and all, but how about a charisma-oriented setup? It be one thing if we were talking Barbarians damage as min max and avg dont have such a wide margin but Paladin can burn as many spell slots to boost damage as they have attacks and bonus actions. Then, chances are you -won't- see lvl 20, let alone lvl 12. Relentless Avenger then lets you back away so that you can repeat the same move the next turn. The inclusion of magic items would not make an ideal scenario for comparing two character builds of the same base class, as the game and class were not designed around them. All rights reserved. I'm planning a level 10 character for the game I'll be. An open hand monk would have 2 attacks of flurry blow to do this, and can stun the targets. This was a misunderstanding on my point cause the bulk of what was talked about between me and Rexir had to do comparing different build. More often than not if you are raising your damage, you are raising your minimum damage anyway. I disagree with the math. What do yall think? Maneuvering Attack is another good tactical fun choice. As total Round damage will be roughly the same. We have updated our privacy policy. A glaive (or halberd) would of course be superior mathematically. You can't add it in your scenario because it's in a void but in order to determine the usefulness of that everyone needs to ask themselves a question: how many times have I been approached by an attacking monster and didn't use a reaction? Because who cares how much damage you're dealing when nothing can hit you. Any idea yet on what the rest of the party is going to be? Fighter 7 - Extra Superiority Die, two more Maneuvers. Best Archer Valor Bard build for these parameters? Carrying a quarterstaff or a spear, anything that triggers AoO gets slapped withbooming blade and possibly divine smite. Fighter 10 - Two more Maneuvers, and your Superiority Dice are now d10s. All rights reserved. All your really doing is in creasing Max single Round damage not total Damage. I'm not arguing that by any means. Paladin are Nova Dealers. Here's the article on Joe. For your starting weapon, choose the glaive, pike, halberd, or quarterstaff. I'll have to give it a go! Combining a Disarm Attack & a Push Attack outside of your reach leaves an opponent in a very bad place! Yes, the lich over there can cast disintegrate but the hordes of zombies and skeletons shambling to the nearby village can decimate a populace quickly. As long as you can mitigate the accuracy loss or as long as you are hitting stuff that is easy to hit but is a damage sponge, it's an excellent feat. I think you're getting a lot of the answers you expected, and they're great answers, but I'd probably go vhuman sword and board(dueling) with the Heavy Armor Mastery feat at level 1, then pump Str +2 at level 4 and the +2 to Char at level 8. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. As for race probably half-orc , or vuman for that 1lvl feat, or maybe leonin for that additional fear ability? These are going to be +2 but that is still higher than any other class that has an 8 as an ability score. 1. If you're just looking for DPR, I'd recommend Variant Human. Sentinel+PAM vs. GWM Hello all, Currently playing a homebrew campaign and am having some questions about which would be more effective. So we have awesome spells including Haste, we have advantage on all attacks from Oath plus Fear on target for 1 min. JavaScript is disabled. If you compare with other melee options, isn't a good idea build a melee small beast master. Fighting Styles: Great Weapon Fighting, Dueling, Defense, Protection? In this very nature though so do flat numbers so you're entire begining arguement is flawed. Also, you might want to consider fitting in Resilient (CON). Advancement is steady so it should be fun at all levels.

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